Originally Posted by FlamingArrow

How would saving someone overwrite their freewill?

Originally Posted by Fjoem

Well, it was their choice to cross the road whether they could see the car coming or not, you are intervening with their decision, forcing your will on them.

Originally Posted by FlamingArrow

If they knew the car was coming, they wouldn't have made the decision to cross.

Originally Posted by FlamingArrow

If they knew the car was coming, they wouldn't have made the decision to cross.

Originally Posted by Fjoem

Thats exactly my point, if people could see the illusion they would not choose to live under it, so does that make it ok to force our will upon them?

Heya Rinnie, long time no speak!

Originally Posted by FlamingArrow

Ah ok, I see where you are going with this now. It's a good example, but they are two very different situations. You can only help someone as much as they are willing to be helped. For the most part, everyone is willing to be pushed or pulled away from oncoming traffic, but not everyone is ready or willing to change their mind or open their eyes.

Originally Posted by Fjoem

Ye but at the same time everybody wants to free, maybe the difference is that someone crosses the road with the idea that they would be prepared to be pulled from the traffic if they were gonna get hit. But the same principal applies; 'Is it ok to go against somebody's free will in order to protect them?'.

Originally Posted by FlamingArrow

Yes, but no one truly truly knows who is in need of protection, and who is really in danger? What if we're wrong? What if we just live in a computer?

Where as, in a car situation, in any case it wouldn't be a problem to step in.




lol.

Originally Posted by Naterade

You can't force someone to be free, they've got to find it on their own. Even if you force them into a situation which you may deem as better, they won't accept it unless they personally have had a shift in perspective, and that is not something you can make happen, only they can. That's like saying ok, we have utopia, a perfect planet, now let's throw in a bunch of unconscious humans, they'll thank us for bringing them there against their will because it's perfect. The problem is, they didn't choose it and won't know why they're doing it, or how to keep it up or even see it as perfect in their own opinion. People will do what they want to do, and it will eventually be ruined. Really, this is pretty much what happened when god put us on earth. The world is perfect right now, in this instant, but not everyone realizes it, so they move backwards. In any moment we could go, oh ok well let's drop the bullshit and start reversing the effects of what we've done. Instead we continue to move backward. When one awakens and becomes present to the moment, they start their personal process of reversing the effects they've self inflicted. Any anyone who's experienced that was never forced into it, you can't be, they had a self-realization and shift in perspective that they achieved. You can only control your own mind, not that of others.