why jesus died on the cross

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" wrote:I guess it all depends on how one defines worship...if worship means being in joy of life and celebrating the joy of God then what is wrong with that?


Absolutely nothing and why I was asking people to define worship...
The way I see people worship leads me to believe that vast majority of people see it far differently.
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Calibas
 
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" wrote:its not that she needs it,, let me put it another way,, when a parent shows a child how to do something and then the child smiles back to the parent thats like sending the energy back,do ya get me,,when we do good we send that energy back which makes god happy,,


So it is almost like showing gratitude and at the same time giving joy to It?
sean...why do you call God a she?

The issue I see with worship is it puts God above the worshiper, instead of Within.

I guess it actually depends on the religion you follow and how do you define worship. For Christians god is definetely woshiped as a seperate entitity. God in heaven, us on earth. But if you believe that in reality you are not separate from god, then worship at least the cristian defenition of it is redundant. Now if by worship you mean enjoying the beauties of life and loving god for all the wonders that are out there, then there is nothing wrong with that, actually by loving you get closer to the object of your affection, whether it is within or outside.
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bluetsubaki
 
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i call god a she cuz, well if i was to define god as something even though i know its everything and nothing,, i would call it a she as they are the source of love, lets face it if god really was a man well i dont want to go there the planet would be used as a space ship crashing into other planets he made like a child with a toy,,, i dont think we would fare out to well in that scene,,lol

when you erite to me you show me something, in return i write back,, and there is the circle complete,,,
if i write telling you that you are the most wonderful person that i know, and mean it you heart will be filled with energy(emotion) and in return you are more likely to do something good to someone else or myself,,, energy returned,,, imagine if everyone was doing this
everything in life is energy thats it simply,,so give your energy as jesus did and it will be returned as it has to be,,
another way of looking at it is imagine two glasses full of water ut therer is pipes connecting them if you pour water into one well the water will come out of the other and flow into the other,, so they are always filling each other up,,we are connected thats a fact,, as if you sing a song in your head someone sings it aloud ,, thats proof we are connected,,if you give god gives to you, and the person you gave to againg believes there is a god which put that energy back to god,, and what does god do but give it back to you again and so on it goes,,, i hope this helps,,

what about bad people i hear ya say,,, well what about them,, their bad for a reason no ones born bad,, help them to be good if you can and that circle will be renewed,,, its easy to help the needy,, help someone thats a pain in the arse,,and even as im writing i,m learning so thank you for the question,,,
sean keyes
 
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by the way i,m no saint or any thing like that but i do believe in god and love her to bits,,, and remember this friday that poor whore got killed for us 1977 years ago,,he was a good man, who had our hearts in mind,,the love he had was so much that he took some beating never mind the cross, but the beating he took because he believed in us,,it would be the same as a mother for its child,, and he did not even know us,,
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I don't believe that jesus died on the cross. I suspect the story was built around this to give christianity more clout.
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james
 
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" wrote:I don't believe that jesus died on the cross. I suspect the story was built around this to give christianity more clout.


would it matter if he died on the bonnet of a car (hood) he died for a reason does not matter where he died or what on ,, it was the death that was important
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The symbol of the cross is important to most christians. The death was only important if you believe that he hasn't been born since...
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james
 
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" wrote:would it matter if he died on the bonnet of a car (hood) he died for a reason does not matter where he died or what on ,, it was the death that was important


I think this is the greatest betrayal of Jesus' message, to say his death was the important part... Saying that Humanity was somehow saved by doing something so supremely ignorant as killing Jesus. To believe that you'd have to believe that God held all this stuff against Humanity, and then when they killed Jesus all was forgiven. I'm not sure how that worked exactly... I've heard some people suggest that it was the whole ancient idea of a blood sacrifice...

Jesus death was the least important part, his Life and his Message are the true legacy.
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" wrote:I think this is the greatest betrayal of Jesus' message, to say his death was the important part... Saying that Humanity was somehow saved by doing something so supremely ignorant as killing Jesus. To believe that you'd have to believe that God held all this stuff against Humanity, and then when they killed Jesus all was forgiven. I'm not sure how that worked exactly... I've heard some people suggest that it was the whole ancient idea of a blood sacrifice...

Jesus death was the least important part, his Life and his Message are the true legacy.


it was simply a ransom, to balence the sins of the world jesus was the only one who could do it,, like he was as important as the whole earth,,no one esle could do it,would he been remembered if he died of natural causes,, or was his very dramatic death something that stays in peoples heads, people remember 9,11 they can tell you where they were what they were doing all around the world,, things that dramatic sticks in peoples heads, sorry but you have to take it out with the manufactur, as to why dramatic events stick in our heads,,,

so do you think if he died of natural causes would he be remember as much,,
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" wrote:it was simply a ransom, to balence the sins of the world jesus was the only one who could do it,, like he was as important as the whole earth,,no one esle could do it,would he been remembered if he died of natural causes,, or was his very dramatic death something that stays in peoples heads, people remember 9,11 they can tell you where they were what they were doing all around the world,, things that dramatic sticks in peoples heads, sorry but you have to take it out with the manufactur, as to why dramatic events stick in our heads,,,

so do you think if he died of natural causes would he be remember as much,,


I agree that martyrdom certainly gets the message out, and to the end it was useful, yet the church concentrates more on the martyrdom than the actual message (hence the cross). If he was willing to die to spread his message, shouldn't we concentrate more on his Life than his death?
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Calibas
 
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" wrote:it was simply a ransom, to balence the sins of the world jesus was the only one who could do it,, like he was as important as the whole earth,,no one esle could do it,would he been remembered if he died of natural causes,, or was his very dramatic death something that stays in peoples heads, people remember 9,11 they can tell you where they were what they were doing all around the world,, things that dramatic sticks in peoples heads, sorry but you have to take it out with the manufactur, as to why dramatic events stick in our heads,,,

so do you think if he died of natural causes would he be remember as much,,


our creator, god and jesus just the same as every soul: they are who they are and they do what they do. the suggestion of jesus being the only spirit to take the sins of the world is so far away from where it's really at. there was a message or two and people will get there sooner or later. all in good time...
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james
 
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" wrote:I agree that martyrdom certainly gets the message out, and to the end it was useful, yet the church concentrates more on the martyrdom than the actual message (hence the cross). If he was willing to die to spread his message, shouldn't we concentrate more on his Life than his death?


yes true we should as he lived a great life teaching, but he did ask us to remember his death once a year,, he was a great man,,
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Basically cause of some really shitty people--- sorta like a BC version of the Bush administration--- said he had to go... you know...Like JFK et al. To think otherwise shows a vested interest in placing your beliefs in something akin to human sacrifice...
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its a ransom not a sacrafice,, for he was not sacraficed,, as he knew he was always going to die,,he had to do it ,, it needed a pure human to cleanse humans again,,,and as jesus was not from adams blood line but sent through god to mary ,, he was as pure,,, that was the ransom,
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" wrote:its a ransom not a sacrafice,, for he was not sacraficed,, as he knew he was always going to die,,he had to do it ,, it needed a pure human to cleanse humans again,,,and as jesus was not from adams blood line but sent through god to mary ,, he was as pure,,, that was the ransom,


So God needed an innocent human sacrifice to appease God?

No offense (not like you came up with that belief) but that's kinda disturbing to say the least.
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Calibas
 
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now your getting there,,, and lets face facts,, this isnt the real deal as yee know,, god needed a pure soul,, as adam was unpure everyone after him would be unpure,, so god choose his only son jesus,, as the lamb of god,
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" wrote:now your getting there,,, and lets face facts,, this isnt the real deal as yee know,, god needed a pure soul,, as adam was unpure everyone after him would be unpure,, so god choose his only son jesus,, as the lamb of god,


God needed a pure soul as a blood sacrifice? Why exactly does God need anything sacrificed to God?
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Calibas
 
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Jesus's death is symbolic in so many forms. What we forget is the fact that Jesus came into this life, agreed to go through this experience. Why some might ask. Well if you think about it he had a message to bring. Even his death was symbolic because it does show the resurrection within our light bodies. They say that Jesus was the light...that he came to shine the way so to speak to make the path easier for others to follow his example. What is wrong with recognizing his death as equally important as his life and teachings? For his teachings make it possible to connect with spirit. He was a living example of the process and we can't just "cut out" part of this process just because it "shouldn't" have happened.
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He didn't die on the cross, another took his place ;) *GASP*

Even traditionally, he didn't die, he Ascended. hehe.

Why was he crucified? Because he was a threat to the Romans and their power, as well as other Priesthoods. He was beginning to help people free themselves, their minds, and their spirits. And IMO, taught far more advanced meditative/occult techniques and knowledge than what "Christianity" claims it teaches. Funny how contemporary (not true Christianity) Christianity actually derived from the Roman Catholic version of the events and gospels.The Catholic church decided which ones would be put into the bible, and decided what details to leave in, and what translations to mess up. Furthermore the King James version does it further...

Then there is the matter of the gnostic Bible and Jesus, and I consider there to be much accuracy in there too-but still missing many key elements.

He sacrificed himself so that we may remember the story, and learn the truth of who we are and where we come from. Unfortunately- that truth was hidden long ago, and nearly lost. Thankfully the truth can never be fully erased- and survives in hidden clues within the Occult, the bible, other religions, and within the spirit in itself.

Furthermore the "Crucifixion of Christ" is also a symbolic representation of what happened to the "Christ" within man. Energetically, and genetically "disfigurement" to create an external focused consciousness never finding truth or "salvation" because we became obsessed with hierarchy and external answers to the divine nature within.
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mathew 20;28 just as the son of man did not come to be served, but to serve,and to give his life as a ransom for many,,

psalm 49;7,8 no man can redeem the life of another or give to god a ransom for him,the ransom for a life is costly no payment is ever enough,

1 timothy 2:5 ,6 for there is one god and one mediator between god and men,the man Jesus christ, who gave himself as a ransom for all men- the testoimony givin in its proper time

1 John 4:9 ,10 this is how god showed love among us;he sent his one and only son, into the world that we might live through him,this is love; not that we loved God but that he loved us and sent his only son as an atoning sacrafice for our sins

hebrews 10; 5, 7 therefore when christ came into the world,he said,sacrifes and offerings you did not desire,but a body you prepared for me,with burnt offerings and sin offerings you were not pleased,then i said here i am it is written about me in the scroll,i have come to do your will ,O God ,

the word atoning means , to make amends for a sin or fault,,

hebrews 10; 10 and by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrafice of the body of Jesus christ, once and for all
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