Please define "Evil"

[sshenry]

altruism it is cute and all, but if you don't have anti biotics, you won't be able to efficiently prevent a person to die from pneumonia and even in a more general sense, even if you take it on the very level of the soul, what make one able to really form his mind to reach an idea of good, an idea of altruism, is still the same processus of reasoning and thinking that is behind the formation of any kind of science even postulating that we need to feed the world or anything else, it is still based from a rational reflexion about what we need to do, based on a sort of paradigm, that cannot be achieve without this same processus of thinking, even if it is not considered as science in the current academic sense, in the original sense of knowlege and science, it touch directly on the level of the soul and how thinking impact your whole being and your behavior, that's not limited to engineering or newtonian kind of science of thermodynamics

Darlin - if the person can't afford health insurance - they won't be getting the antibiotics either. Just sayin.


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[h0bby1]

Darlin - if the person can't afford health insurance - they won't be getting the antibiotics either. Just sayin.

yes but that's not really doctors who decide this, just sayin and that's only in america :=)

[h0bby1]

and if they were' no doctor, even with 2000$ / mont health assurance they could still die on their foot with the open mouth and it is not that easy to find the thing that bring the ability heal ppl, health insurance or not darlin christian altruism was what has allow great plague to happen, altruism doesn't solved everything either health insurance or not

[sshenry]

yes but that's not really doctors who decide this, just sayin and that's only in america :=)

So there's still a disconnect. Even if the scientists (or doctors, or whoever) are doing it for the right reasons - it's not being put to the right uses. At least not yet.

It's been hijacked by the highest bidder.

[h0bby1]

if doctors and medicine are so evil, and that medical resarch is so intrinsecly evil, why you even need an health insurance at all to begin with ?

[h0bby1]

So there's still a disconnect. Even if the scientists (or doctors, or whoever) are doing it for the right reasons - it's not being put to the right uses. At least not yet.

It's been hijacked by the highest bidder.

well go ahead, do medicine study, do the contest, become a doctor and gain this ability to heal cancer and AIDS and go do it in the street then

[h0bby1]

but hospital manager and health budget manager are not really doctors, just sayin they didn't take any hypocrates oath or anything they are not even scientist in any way, they more financial guy, investor or that kind of persons

[Breedtracer]

@H0b >> I gotta go to bed (can't seem to sleep enough this week, between the GF and the morning earthquakes) but to keep the thread going, lol, I'd bet you my ass that the Doctors who contributed to improving medicine where the guys in the lab, cutting open dogs and cadavers. The street doctors were wonderful human beings but probably died young, miserable and family-less. Just like people who invented great things did it out of personal curiosity rather than out of desire to improve society (imo)

and I stand by what I said about a lot of modern technology we take for granted were found by accident or luck.
A big bunch of medications and chemicals too. We've never really gathered scientists to save the world, except in movies and soviet russia. Even today, scientists and academics work hard for fame, pride and their own name on the memorial board. If the need to improve fueled science, we'd have mega laboratories with millions of scientists gathered from the whole planet, financed by leading countries. Instead we have Microsoft scouting geniuses to make flat screens in Silicon Valley.

gnight guys and gals

I agree completely with you on this. It's a shame that instead of trying to advance ourselves as a whole people are worried about their own careers being selfish in the end bc of it. We as a whole def need to get our ish together; to be said lightly at least.

[h0bby1]

greed is not medicine, then doctors or health practicer can be greedy, but that's not the essence of medicine or medical research at all, and ppl who do medical research don't do it only for monney either, it is still very hard work, very time consuming and stressing, and they still do it to be able to solve issues and to help ppl at first, or if anything has to be adequatly termed medical research it is this, then all the buisness or greed or anything that get integrated into it, well that's not what is to be called medical research, if ppl do scam for greed, they are not doctors or scientific researcher period, and still most proeminent scientist didn't do it at first for monney , edison, telsa einstein pasteur flemming, ambrois pare, marie curie or others, they all spent great deal of time living quite ascetic life, even often at the risk of their life during catholic era, focused on their research with helping ppl in mind and improving life condition at first

but go ahead, try to mount a lab and study to find cure for AIDS or cancer, and see how easy it is to do this and how much it need to be only greedy brainless interested person to find efficient cure for anything or to make an exploitation system or anything else that ppl are eager to buy or get while not doing one tenth of the work that those ppl did to come out with them

[h0bby1]

and in the bottom yoi know why researcher are like this why the whole research turned out like that ?

i can tell you why, it is exactly because of ppl with your kind of mindset, who despise science, who despise educated, because they don't spend their day drinking beer in the pub with you, and instead need time to focus alone on their hard scientific work , that they would be unable to carry one if there wouldn't be investor behind them to fund them because nobody give a single shit about anything expect pretending to be altruistic and despising any of those type of guy an in the bottom all want health insurance cell phone and just complain because it is not cheap enought and not avaible enought to everyone while just sitting there being despising it that's just the sad reality why it is all funded by rockfeller fundation in hype lab, not really because of scientist are greedy but because no one really give a shit about actually making any real significant progress into anything, just complaning that it is not avaible enought while not wanting to do any of this work of life time study and dedication

if you are not happy with it go ahead, make your own research lab, fund your own hospital, make your own exploitation system and cell phone system, i'll see how far you get with it

[h0bby1]

So there's still a disconnect. Even if the scientists (or doctors, or whoever) are doing it for the right reasons - it's not being put to the right uses. At least not yet.

It's been hijacked by the highest bidder.

and it stil doesn't change the usefullness of rationalism and scientistic research in itself, which still render one able to cure something to begin with, without which there would be no cure at all even with all the monney and moutain of gold of the world

now it is not the fault of scientific or medical researcher if ppl prefer to sit on their ass rather than to open a medicine or science book that is avaible in any library to actually educated themselve and do this job of curing things like just any good doctor or researcher do every day of their life to be up to date to be able to cure their patient

and it is not the fault of doctors if in america ppl swear only by their dollars and their capitalism unlike any other country of the world where health is avaible for everyone

[h0bby1]

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/ i mean go ahead by any mean put it to good use , every body is watching you

[novice]

...I'm rather confused. I thought this was an abstract discussion on evil...but all I'm seeing in recent posts is some sort of health care debate

[h0bby1]

http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ not happy with microsoft, go ahead please grab a kernal source, (free) and gcc compiler (free), and improve this, make a great free os for everyone,that's sure easy as 1 2 3 just need to be greedy as hell and all is done by itself

[h0bby1]

...I'm rather confused. I thought this was an abstract discussion on evil...but all I'm seeing in recent posts is some sort of health care debate

yes, but i guess you didn't follow the thread to begin with, about ignorance is evil and how about science and knowledge become the evil and how those researcher who spend their life to find efficient cure are just greedy demon stay ignorant, stay evil

[h0bby1]

it is because evil is just about not being able to open a science book and then complaining about the price of health insurance

[h0bby1]

or, better, no i got it, you prefer to wait to find the miracule cure for aids and cancer by pure luck and accident like of course it always happened this way

better to read this than being blind

[h0bby1]

http://www.pasteur.fr/ip/easysite/pasteur/en those are pure evil !!!! lol

http://www.pasteur.fr/ip/easysite/pa...stitut-pasteur

A foundation for research and public health

Since its creation in 1887, the Institut Pasteur has become famous throughout the world as a symbol of science and french culture. For 120 years, our foundation has been contributing to the prevention and treatment of infectious diseases through research, teaching and public health initiatives.Across the globe, thousands of researchers who have been trained or are working at Institut Pasteur share the values which form the very core of the Pasteurian community: an original scientifi c approach, an ongoing preoccupation with applying research to public health needs, professional ethics, a desire to care for people regardless of their background or nationality, and an outward-looking attitude, sharing knowledge and expertise with the international community. These guiding principles make the Institut Pasteur a unique institution which values exchanges and partnerships.

i mean it is true, what is this greedy pasteur institute international medical research compared to those great holly alstruistic new agers !!!

[h0bby1]

or maybe you are the one to only do thing when you are assured to get some fame for them, and not wanting to take the enormous risk to read t ons of books for never getting any fame, and not taking the enormous risk to make some wheel to spin in your head while it will not get you rich & famous ? unlike more researcher who take this risk, and actually managge to form idea of things, and are never heard about ever exepct when one of them do a sort of mistake while other don't even take the risk at all but are well happy to have all this technology ?

i mean go ahead otherwise, go leave in a cave in the forest, drope all your clothe your comp and all and go live with a fox skin underwear in the forest if you think it is so great compared to modern life lol

[h0bby1]

but in the bottom what really drive me nut with this whole kind of speech, and i had this discussion with many ppl and not only over internet, it is that you got ppl who are still using a rational reasoning, based on a rational analysis of a situation, with casualty, in fact a very rational based thinking, quite scientific, about analysis of society, and what it lead to, and also these ppl are advocating a sort of change or progress exactly based on a rational thinking, a pure idealism in the bottom, advocating a change based on an idea that is rather rational, and still saying that science and rationalism is bad, and say that the very method of thinking they use to advocate their change is flawed, it is exactly like a children being caught with a cookie in his hand saying 'which cookie jar' lol